Jonathan Drake

Joined

• started 28 topics
• posted 710 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by Jonathan Drake

• 
  53

  Spirituality

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely.

  im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience.

  i'm currently reading sam harris book waking up and it's very good so far.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  So I just had an interesting experience I'm not sure if is legitimate. But I'm going to share it.

  on page 100 of this book Harris suggests sitting for 60 seconds and just being aware without thinking. I did this, and I tried it several times. My latest attempt I was sitting here with my eyes closed just being aware. I heard birds and thought "birds" and and let the thought go by without addressing it. The same happened with vehicles on the road, music I heard next door. And then it hit me all at once that absolutely NONE of these thoughts were mine. They were as involuntary as breathing. They are not what makes me conscious.

  In the moment of this realization I experienced this feeling of not being a self, which is exactly what he states the point is. It startled me out of trying to meditate it was so severe (though brief). It left me with the experience and realization that thinking does not define being. In challenging the famous line, "I think therefore I am" I feel after this experience that this is completely false. Our thoughts, ALL of them, originate with entirely involuntary ideas. I.e., you see the garbage can full and it triggers the thought that it must go out. The thought is completely involuntary. The subsequent decision of whether to take it out or ignore it is another matter, but the mere act of thinking says nothing in terms of being because thoughts are not voluntary - they do not come about by choice.

  as I said, I am unsure of the legitimacy of this experience. This is because it is only my 8th attempt or so at meditation. But it feels very significant to me. It was sort of frightening tbh, but in a sort of fashion I imagine skydiving to be.
• 
  4

  LOL LOL LOL!!!!! Has the G.B./Org ALREADY left this planet????

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  at 10m 20secs of the convention's new video release, the father tells his daughter that she is too young at 17-18 years old to consider dating - because even at 18 years old, her husband wouldn't be mature enough to be her 'spiritual head'!.

  i'll bet her father had her baptized when she was "spiritually mature" enough at 10 years of age!

  the org's chariot is really being driven out of control by some guys who are heading for a thelma & louise finale - keep this stuff coming, please!!!!.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  This is a great point, there's no different between marriage and baptism. Both are life long commitments through sickness and health until death.

  but one is not allowed for young adults while the other is encouraged for young children?

  posted to Facebook. This is such a good point.
• 
  53

  Spirituality

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely.

  im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience.

  i'm currently reading sam harris book waking up and it's very good so far.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  I also appreciate that initial explanation of what he means by spiritual very much.

  Ive not finished it yet, but so far he's made one point in particular that has stuck with me quite strongly. This point he makes is regarding the reality of spirituality and why it need not be taken on faith; he says that the experiences of Buddha, Jesus and other sages and prophets are in agreement with each other with things like loving ones neighbor as yourself. These agreements transcend the religions which spawned in their wake, they agree with each other despite the irreconcilable differences and hatred of one another. If these spiritual experiences are able to agree across the religious board when nothing else can be such a bridge - then there is truly something there.

  i didn't put it quite as elequently as him but that was the jist of his point and I felt it a very powerful and valid one.
• 
  53

  Spirituality

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely.

  im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience.

  i'm currently reading sam harris book waking up and it's very good so far.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  If you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely. Thank you to those who do.

  Im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience. I'm currently reading Sam Harris book Waking Up and it's very good so far. It has me thinking about this subject because of how he explains such an experience.

  he states in the book that he responsibly tried ecstasy when he was younger and the alteration of his conscious state brought on a seriously life changing moment in which he realized that love is boundless and no one need love, "because". He realized that were a perfect stranger to walk through the door he would love them. He would want them to be happy.

  He is writing about mankind a inherent spiritual desire. It is his opinion that this desire has been monopolized and misrepresented and misunderstood by religion because the famous sages and prophets who had these experiences viewed them through a lens of faith and dogma.

  i can attest to this, because I have had one such experience as he is describing. And it was literally the same experience, but without the assistance of a drug. I was watching Les Miserables and something about how the message of the plot was portrayed and demonstrated brought on this sudden realization that fits exactly what he is discribing. It was like all at once I realized love is not a two way street and I want everyone to be happy; I will do what I can to make this so at whatever cost to myself I can afford. Of course, at the time I believed in God and I, as he said, viewed this experience through a lens of faith. But the experience was, all the same, life changing. I no longer had certain selfish traits I realized in that moment we're absurd. It can be said that it literally changed my personality.

  So, I'm curious if anyone has had experiences such as these?
• 
  60

  Ten Commandments

  by EA916 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  should we still be keeping the 10 commandments?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  The Ten Commandments say nothing about stoning, they have no punishments.
  

  First of all, you're incorrect; the Ten Commandments do have punishments. It just appears you've chosen not to continue reading to the part where they are outlined.

  Secondly, a commandment, law, or rule which has no consequence when broken is completely useless. This is not a commandment without punishment, it's just a suggestion. The events in ancient Israel which took place when these commandments were violated prove you completely wrong and possibly even deranged.

  and finally, regardless of whether you choose to read the punishments or not they exist. If you plan out and accomplish a murder in today's society you will not be excused because you didn't know there were punishments. Therefore if your God is real, and if the Ten Commandments should be followed, then you are going to be stoned to death someday or otherwise killed by your loving God.

  This is the reality of your proposition, and there is nothing you can do to change it.
• 
  60

  Ten Commandments

  by EA916 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  should we still be keeping the 10 commandments?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  I feel like the answer to your question rests within the fact that the Ten Commandments, supposedly written as you say, "by gods finger" say nothing at all extraordinary. There is nothing special about them.

  The first four are specifically religously concerned, and none of the laws were unique because many cultures long before God wrote these oh so wise words had laws just like them, one of which was Egypt, the land from which they allegedly had just come. The one time God actually writes something himself and all he manages to do is copy off of humans? Not very impressive for an all wise and all powerful deity.

  Further, if you would be willing to submit yourself to such an archaic and barbaric standard then you would have to be willing to accept the consequences of violating it. Thus I expect it wouldn't be long before you were stoned to death, unless of course you wished to ignore that unpleasant part. But then you wouldn't be truly living by the standard would you?
  
• 
  75

  Rumor about the Imitate Jesus Convention

  by FusionTheism in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i saw a rumor a few weeks ago on reddit that the new imitate jesus convention is supposed to present new light and clarified understandings on the disfellowshipping/disassociation practices.. supposedly, if this rumor has any truth to it, there will be a talk given at the convention about how we should not be strict like the pharisees in how we shun people, loosening up some of the jw rules about this practice.. has anyone here heard anything about this or have more info on it?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  This would be the best thing to ever happen. The religion would die out fast.
• 
  17

  Possibly a great question to ask JW's since this last week's WT.

  by Crazyguy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so since the type anti-type doctrine has been dropped 'does this mean peter was right when at luke 12 :41 he said the faithful and discreet slave was just a parable?

  '

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  Peter wasnt talking about the faithful steward as a parable. He was talking about the foregoing parable of readiness. In RESPONSE to peters inquiry, Jesus asked, "who is the faithful and wise steward?"

  i dont think this will work at all.
• 
  1

  Council for National Policy

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  who has heard of these clowns?

  i just read about them and it has made me want to move to europe asap.

  1. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  Who has heard of these clowns? I just read about them and it has made me want to move to Europe ASAP.
• 
  48

  Evidence based folks: what is your stance on GMO's and why?

  by cappytan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so, the anti-gmo movement scored another victory today.

  chipotle has opted to only use non-gmo food items.. hooray for them.

  i'm pretty neutral on the subject, mostly because, other than questionable treatment of farmers, i have seen no evidence to avoid gmo's for health reasons.. basically, my neutrality boils down to the stance that i'll buy non-gmo, so long as the price is reasonable.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Jonathan Drake

  I'm pretty neutral on gmo. I don't know if it's been around long enough for us to actually see how it will effect everything. But until there is actual evidence to suggest it's bad I'm not bothered.